M14 Forum

lefty o · December 1st, 2011, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweets

But Man is now such a puny animal that the military have decided that all you need to use is a .22! [insert M1A/M14 promo here].

thought we were discussing using a shotgun, not starting .223 arguments!?!?!?

Sweets · December 2nd, 2011, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lefty o

thought we were discussing using a shotgun, not starting .223 arguments!?!?!?

Joke! Who can resist?

lefty o · December 2nd, 2011, 02:10 PM

just about everyone!

Lee D · December 3rd, 2011, 01:52 PM

like we were taught years ago in the CCW class, shoot to kill so there is only one story to be told.
as for Massad's stuff, i read everything he writes. if you can learn thru other's experiences, you will be better prepared to deal with the "aftermath" when and if you do have to defend yourself and your family.

Gearjammer · December 3rd, 2011, 05:07 PM

The above guy and Massad Ayoob agree with me, if you make sure they dead the prosecution is pretty much out of first hand witnesses as when he questions you , you get to practice the 5th level of "Go f*** yourself!" with the DA's office.

BagemTagem · December 4th, 2011, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gearjammer

The above guy and Massad Ayoob agree with me, if you make sure they dead the prosecution is pretty much out of first hand witnesses as when he questions you , you get to practice the 5th level of "Go f*** yourself!" with the DA's office.

none of this applies in Texas.

You are in my home? bam without question, a grand jury wont question it. Im not going to say "Hey why are you here?"

Especially at night. all we need here is a simple purple stripe that is visible from any angle(i.e. in several locations) and at eye level and that is enough, according to state law, to warn trespassers.

Back on topic. I load 3" Mag Blind Side from Winchester. Its designed for goose hunting.

k5yac · December 5th, 2011, 08:21 AM

I'm also in agreement with using effective force when necessary. Dead bad guy = good bad guy. I'm was mainly trying to suggest that everyone consider their safety first (themselves and their family). I too have the urge to investigate bumps in the night, but I don't want to kill anyone that may just be confused (yes, it happens), nor do I want to take on a person or persons with unknown intentions or capabilities. What if I choose to investigate and find that I am out gunned? Now I'm injured or worse, and my wife is the next (last) line of defense because I did something stupid. The problem is... in a home invasion I don't know how many friends they brought, how well armed they are, how desperate they are, etc., therefore I am at a huge disadvantage. If I had intel and could assess the situation then devise a proper plan, well maybe I'd have a surprise for them, but that is never the case in these situations.

In keeping with the thread... you should use whatever ammo would be most effective in neutralizing a bad situation (i.e. defending your life) while causing the least amount of collateral damage, not just to YOUR property, but your neighbors as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BagemTagem

none of this applies in Texas. You are in my home? bam without question, a grand jury wont question it. Im not going to say "Hey why are you here?"

Especially at night. all we need here is a simple purple stripe that is visible from any angle(i.e. in several locations) and at eye level and that is enough, according to state law, to warn trespassers.

Not a problem here in Oklahoma either... in fact, NRA ILA has praised Oklahoma as having some of the best pro-gun laws in the country. But when you say "none of this applies"... again, you are suggesting that you are untouchable in any situation in your home... careful with that. If you miss with that big 'ol S&W 500 (Texas Gun) and put one into your sleeping neighbor (or even your neighbor's property), believe me, you'll be answering questions regardless of your intentions.

Now, about this purple stripe. Are you saying that you must display a "we have guns in our home" sign where it is visible to everyone? Please tell me that isn't the case. If so, that is a BAD idea. One, you are advertising to the bad guys that you have valuables (guns) available for the taking the next time you are away. Second, depending on how desperate they are, they know what kind of fight to be prepared for before they even enter. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

I guess we all look at situations from our own perspective. I live at the end of a rural drive on the fringe of our county. I am near a municipality, but can't count on them to be there as soon as I might like. We are somewhat rural, which we like, but we are also on our own in several situations... need 22" of snow plowed from our road? Gotta wait. Need power lines repaired after a storm? Gotta wait. Need life saving fire or police help? In the case of life and death, it is close, but never close enough. That is why we have devised a plan tailored to OUR situation, as everyone should. Again, with the primary goal being to survive... not thinking of what the law will supposedly allow.

If someone is coming into my bedroom window, yes... bang is the answer. If someone has tripped the alarm at the other end of the house... well, I'll be glad that we practiced a sound plan ahead of time. As we used to say... train as you fight, fight as you train. If I EVER have to take a life, hopefully it would be clear that it was never my intention, simply a last resort.

dcobra823 · December 6th, 2011, 06:29 PM

My High Standard Riot Gun is loaded with #1 BUCK SHOT & by my night stand!

BagemTagem · December 9th, 2011, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k5yac

I'm also in agreement with using effective force when necessary. Dead bad guy = good bad guy. I'm was mainly trying to suggest that everyone consider their safety first (themselves and their family). I too have the urge to investigate bumps in the night, but I don't want to kill anyone that may just be confused (yes, it happens), nor do I want to take on a person or persons with unknown intentions or capabilities. What if I choose to investigate and find that I am out gunned? Now I'm injured or worse, and my wife is the next (last) line of defense because I did something stupid. The problem is... in a home invasion I don't know how many friends they brought, how well armed they are, how desperate they are, etc., therefore I am at a huge disadvantage. If I had intel and could assess the situation then devise a proper plan, well maybe I'd have a surprise for them, but that is never the case in these situations.

In keeping with the thread... you should use whatever ammo would be most effective in neutralizing a bad situation (i.e. defending your life) while causing the least amount of collateral damage, not just to YOUR property, but your neighbors as well.

Not a problem here in Oklahoma either... in fact, NRA ILA has praised Oklahoma as having some of the best pro-gun laws in the country. But when you say "none of this applies"... again, you are suggesting that you are untouchable in any situation in your home... careful with that. If you miss with that big 'ol S&W 500 (Texas Gun) and put one into your sleeping neighbor (or even your neighbor's property), believe me, you'll be answering questions regardless of your intentions.

Now, about this purple stripe. Are you saying that you must display a "we have guns in our home" sign where it is visible to everyone? Please tell me that isn't the case. If so, that is a BAD idea. One, you are advertising to the bad guys that you have valuables (guns) available for the taking the next time you are away. Second, depending on how desperate they are, they know what kind of fight to be prepared for before they even enter. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

I guess we all look at situations from our own perspective. I live at the end of a rural drive on the fringe of our county. I am near a municipality, but can't count on them to be there as soon as I might like. We are somewhat rural, which we like, but we are also on our own in several situations... need 22" of snow plowed from our road? Gotta wait. Need power lines repaired after a storm? Gotta wait. Need life saving fire or police help? In the case of life and death, it is close, but never close enough. That is why we have devised a plan tailored to OUR situation, as everyone should. Again, with the primary goal being to survive... not thinking of what the law will supposedly allow.

If someone is coming into my bedroom window, yes... bang is the answer. If someone has tripped the alarm at the other end of the house... well, I'll be glad that we practiced a sound plan ahead of time. As we used to say... train as you fight, fight as you train. If I EVER have to take a life, hopefully it would be clear that it was never my intention, simply a last resort.

The purple stripe is a subsitute for a no trespassing sign. as i understand the law

rabidus · December 9th, 2011, 11:23 PM

#1 Buck.

If over penetration is not a factor, then 00 will be just fine although #1 causes 30% more trauma than 00 buck.

I wouldn't use birdshot, can it kill the guy? Sure, but there are better loads.

Nomad · December 26th, 2011, 01:46 PM

Opinions will vary as what to use in home defense, one should look at different types of
reports and testing.
Many law enforcement agencys have gone away from the shotgun to use it as a less lethal tool bean bags and several other non-lethal rounds....
00 will pass threw person and may endanger other person in your house like childern in their beds....
You may want to look at different options such as what is listed in the sites below:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/ammo_by_anonymous.htm
http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Self_De..._FAQ/index.htm
Just my .......... .02