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EBR Heel Gap

This is a discussion on EBR Heel Gap within the Modern M14 forums, part of the M14 M1A Forum category; So after a few months of trying to track down and finally getting a NSG EBR stock, I installed my receiver while watching Tony's video. ...


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Old February 22nd, 2017, 08:28 AM   #1
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EBR Heel Gap

So after a few months of trying to track down and finally getting a NSG EBR stock, I installed my receiver while watching Tony's video. He does talk about a heel gap and tapping with the rubber mallet. I feel like I would be tapping for awhile, almost excessively and causing damage to the stock. It is a springfield receiver, so do will I just need to accept my receiver is way out of spec and the gap will be there?

I am referring to the gap back by the sling points.

Any help is always appreciated.
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Last edited by Warowl; February 22nd, 2017 at 08:39 AM.
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Old February 22nd, 2017, 08:45 AM   #2
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I had to smack mine pretty good with a rubber mallet to seat it properly. Didn't hit the heel, hit towards the center of the receiver with a wooden block in between to avoid marring the finish.

Is your trigger group difficult to lock?

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Old February 22nd, 2017, 08:48 AM   #3
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Yea the trigger group has quite the lock up.

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Old February 22nd, 2017, 08:54 AM   #4
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If the receiver is fully seated from the bolt stop forward, then no hammering will seat the heel. You'll just have to leave it be and test fire it to see how it performs. If you see vertical stringing, then you may have to fill the gap with some sort of shim or JB weld.

I haven't seen the SAGE exhibit vertical stringing yet, but my exposure is limited.

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Old February 22nd, 2017, 04:12 PM   #5
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Mine is tight from the bolt stop forward. I made a shim from some chimney flashing that I had and now the heel is very tight. What little testing I was able to do looks very promising so far my biggest group was 1 3/8 inch and smallest 1 inch with south african, all were 5 shot groups.
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Old February 22nd, 2017, 04:34 PM   #6
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Bryan can you post a picture of what that looks like? Would I just shim or jb weld the back of the heel or would I do the whole heel?

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Old February 22nd, 2017, 05:36 PM   #7
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I just made the shim, if my memory serves me right, 1 3/4 by 1 1/8 inches and cut it so that it follows the inside of the reciever. It will look like the shape of a u, I will have my son take a picture this weekend.

Bryan

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Old February 22nd, 2017, 09:37 PM   #8
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I have a receiver with a heel gap, but my anticipated solution is to take a surface grinder to the front of the legs.

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Old February 26th, 2017, 02:15 PM   #9
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Picture as promised
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Old March 4th, 2017, 04:32 PM   #10
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You can also build it up with some epoxy like PC7.

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Old March 6th, 2017, 09:01 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warowl View Post
So after a few months of trying to track down and finally getting a NSG EBR stock, I installed my receiver while watching Tony's video. He does talk about a heel gap and tapping with the rubber mallet. I feel like I would be tapping for awhile, almost excessively and causing damage to the stock. It is a springfield receiver, so do will I just need to accept my receiver is way out of spec and the gap will be there?

I am referring to the gap back by the sling points.

Any help is always appreciated.
Got the same thing going on with mine. Smith says its fine, and it shoots straight.

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Old March 6th, 2017, 10:09 PM   #12
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Warowl, can you provide additional pics? Both sides of the Sage in the area of the receiver?

Leon McKee

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warowl View Post
So after a few months of trying to track down and finally getting a NSG EBR stock, I installed my receiver while watching Tony's video. He does talk about a heel gap and tapping with the rubber mallet. I feel like I would be tapping for awhile, almost excessively and causing damage to the stock. It is a springfield receiver, so do will I just need to accept my receiver is way out of spec and the gap will be there?

I am referring to the gap back by the sling points.

Any help is always appreciated.

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Old March 7th, 2017, 04:50 AM   #13
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Have you tried shooting it without any modifications yet? Although I said it before, I'll say it again, the range results will tell you if you need to proceed. If groups are erratic, or you see vertical stringing, then you should pay closer attention to the heel.

The tightness of the operating rod guide and how tight the front of the receiver and legs may also have something to do with weather or not you need to bed/shim the heel. The tighter the system is, the better.

I would only look at messing with the heel after you perform an initial test like the one I posted a while back from my Blackfeather testing. The post below is when I first discovered how heel gap can affect accuracy and what to look for. The SAGE and Blackfeather mount the action to the chassis nearly identically. Both have a proprietary operating rod guide which allows the action to be mounted. Both rely on trigger group lockup at the rear. The SAGE has the barrel whip screw, while the Blackfeather has an adjustable operating rod guide to tune a rifle to the chassis.

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Originally Posted by tonyben View Post
I took the BF rifle out last week at 200 and the results were very disappointing! I had a very bad case of vertical stringing! Rather than post it and let speculation run rampant, I decided to solve the problem first, then post it. Here's what I was seeing last week...



This led me to investigate possible issues. I looked over the stock with a very critical eye. I found that the heel was floating over the stock by about 0.012"! I checked the fit of the receiver and the legs as well as the front of the receiver was in full contact. No amount of hammering the receiver with a mallet was going to fix this...





I also noticed that my scope had "skid marks" from where the scope had walked back about 2mm over the last few months of firing. I reseated the scope and hit the range again to see if the scope or the floating heel was the culprit. The vertical stringing was still there. I ended up shimming the heel with muffler heat barrier tape and trimming them to fit. Each layer was 0.003" thick so I laid four layers down.









That 5 minutes of shimming tightened the groups right up and I ended up shooting 7 consecutive 5-shot groups at 200 yards with a low of 1.290" and a high of 2.700" with an average group size of 1.988" at 200 which would be a 100yd average of 0.994".









Life is good! And I get a Leupold scope later this week.

To M14.CA's credit, it is nearly impossible to design a stock that will fit all commercial receivers. I don't know if the issue is my receiver or the stock. If there's a gap, I have a fix and it's cheap and quick.

Tony.


Tony.

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Old March 8th, 2017, 11:06 PM   #14
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@Tony

I like your heal gap solution! Any concerns about the material compressing? I have a Sage that might need this type of solution so sounds interesting!

Leon McKee

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Old March 9th, 2017, 05:30 AM   #15
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I am going to try and take it out shooting this week, hopefully I can have a range report soon. Tony I have to rewatch your video for the whip screw adjustment, unless your methodology on it has changed since the video was made.

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