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Bolt and Bolt roller questions w/ pics

This is a discussion on Bolt and Bolt roller questions w/ pics within the The M14 forums, part of the M14 M1A Forum category; Hoping I can get some feedback. After searching this site, I'm still left with some questions. Rifle is a circa 2002 M1A Scout, bought it ...


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Old January 28th, 2015, 09:50 AM   #1
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Bolt and Bolt roller questions w/ pics

Hoping I can get some feedback. After searching this site, I'm still left with some questions.

Rifle is a circa 2002 M1A Scout, bought it used in 2008, so unknown round count. I've only fed it NATO surplus and my handloads (which are generally pretty mild).

The bolt tail is peening, but I'm not sure if some peening is expected/acceptable. Until a week ago, the hammer was the SAI stock one (non-USGI). I redid the internals of the trigger group with GI parts, since the trigger pin had sheared in half (easy fix, but annoying). Bolt is marked B00038 below the SAI part #, so I think that means it's machined bar stock.

Second, I think the bolt roller is beating itself on the right side bolt lug area, and hitting the upper part of the receiver (under the rear sight). I haven't done the 'paper' test under the roller yet. I'm not sure how much clearance is specified for that area, so rather than a piece of random paper of unknown thickness, I'd rather take my gauges and check for a hard and fast number.

Pictures have red around the areas in question. Just hoping someone can steer me right, though I suspect this rifle is going to end up back at SAI.

Thanks!




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Old January 28th, 2015, 10:00 AM   #2
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That bolt is soft and damaged. Call Springfield Inc. and send it back. That bolt will be replaced with a F series bolt that is forged.

Thanks from tonyben and Rich D
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Old January 28th, 2015, 10:35 AM   #3
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Yeah, I sort of suspected that. Thanks for the sanity check. Time to call SAI and get this squared away.

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Old January 28th, 2015, 10:50 AM   #4
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Just as a side note, your rifle does not require anywhere near the amount of grease you have on it. When you apply grease, only a small amount is required and the excess should be removed.

Thanks from Different and leid
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Old January 28th, 2015, 11:00 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by GardenValley View Post
Just as a side note, your rifle does not require anywhere near the amount of grease you have on it. When you apply grease, only a small amount is required and the excess should be removed.
Thanks, but that's storage greasing, not 'functional' greasing. I put the rifle up a couple years ago after I got the Standard, so I greased the bejeebers out of everything, oiled the bore, etc (high humidity area around here). Reading the forums here the last few days got me curious, so I pulled it out of storage to take a look.

I wiped off enough to snap the pictures before work this morning. :)

Already have my label and RMA from SAI, so away it goes tomorrow. Curious to see if they fix it correctly, and if they give me a new headspace tag.

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Old January 28th, 2015, 11:34 AM   #6
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I understand. Just to help you out in the future, you may want to visit the site of Poly Gun Bags. They sell very reasonably priced rifle-length plastic bags that are heavily impregnated with chemical rust preventive. They work exceptionally well and enable you to store your firearms dry and avoid both the application and the cleaning of preservative grease.

Thanks from angelonm and Wasted ammo

Last edited by GardenValley; January 28th, 2015 at 01:49 PM.
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Old January 28th, 2015, 11:52 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by GardenValley View Post
I understand. Just to help you out in the future, you may want to visit the site of Poly Gun Bags. They sell very reasonably priced rifle-length plastic bags that are heavily impregnated with chemical rust preventive. The work exceptionally well and enable you to store your firearms dry and avoid both the application and the cleaning of preservative grease.
Those are very cool, thank you. Would save me from using up the last of my Plastilube!

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Old January 28th, 2015, 12:45 PM   #8
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It does not appear that the bolt roller is hitting the receiver rail. The area that looks shiny is only contacted by the bolt lug and that is required.

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Old January 28th, 2015, 01:06 PM   #9
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I will pull the op rod tonight and check more closely before I box it up. It's going back for the bolt peening in the least, but I will double-check so I don't put bogus info in the repair request/letter.

Thanks!

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Old January 28th, 2015, 06:49 PM   #10
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It might be the angle of the picture so check, it looks like your barrel is over rotated.

Not a empirical test but the feed ramps should be centered over the op rod guide, in your pictures it appears not centered.


Jim

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Old January 28th, 2015, 08:18 PM   #11
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For what it's worth, it passed the 'paper test' for the bolt roller, and there is no impact mark next to the lug recess on the receiver where the roller would otherwise hit.

The barrel isn't clocked, it's just the angle of the picture.

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Old February 18th, 2015, 02:11 PM   #12
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Quick update.

Sent the rifle off 2/2, got it back 2/16 (would have had it Friday, but I missed UPS and SAI did not tell me they'd shipped, even though I told them to let me know <- their idea, not mine).

Forged bolt, 1.632 headspace. Interesting mix of bolt guts. New FP and new ejector plunger, but same extractor and roller. I'll take it out this weekend and see how it shoots. :)

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Old February 18th, 2015, 04:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardm View Post
Thanks, but that's storage greasing, not 'functional' greasing. I put the rifle up a couple years ago after I got the Standard, so I greased the bejeebers out of everything, oiled the bore, etc (high humidity area around here). .
Love that

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Old February 18th, 2015, 04:49 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jake2far View Post
It might be the angle of the picture so check, it looks like your barrel is over rotated.

Not a empirical test but the feed ramps should be centered over the op rod guide, in your pictures it appears not centered.


Jim
I noticed this also and the barrel stops short inside the receiver. Pictures may be misleading, but it looks like almost an 1/8 of an inch. Notice how far back the feed-ramps are from the edge of the receiver. No feeding issues or damaged brass?

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Old February 18th, 2015, 06:30 PM   #15
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The clocking/timing issue is an artifact of the camera angle and the angle I was holding the rifle. The barrel is actually timed corrected in terms of clockface orientation.

As for the depth of the barrel in relation to the receiver ring, I'm no expert to start with. I do know I was allowed a quick look at 3 GI M14's (literally allowed to look-no-touch), and estimate each had a 1/16-3/32" gap like my Scout. Whether that means 3 other rifles out there are built wrong, or that it's supposed to be like that, I don't know. I haven't found out build details on the M1A (just haven't had time to dig around here).

In the past, the rifle did not chew brass, and it's significantly easier on it than the Garand, or even one of my AR's (I know, apple to crabapple to orange...).

I've spent enough time and money learning the AR platform and the Garand, buying the necessary tools, etc. But I admit despite owning at least on M1A for the past few years, I'm still just getting started on my education about their inner workings, dimensions, tolerances, setup, tooling and so on.

That said, if anyone wants to lay some specific dimensions on me to go and measure, I'm glad to. It's only going to get me more edumuhcated that much sooner!

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