M14 Forum

GARRARD · January 30th, 2012, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAVman

He sounded more 'un-educated' than committed...

"we have an illegal gun problem in New Jersey"

Huh?

CAVman in WYoming

That may very well be the case. Or it could be like when Romney pandered to his liberal state just to get into and stay in the governor's mansion. Either way, ignorance can be just as dangerous as deliberate when it comes to gun control.

Quote:

Originally Posted by geeck

This debate has been going on since it's passage and incoporationist interpretation. We are not going to ever agree but my statement of:

Any government big enough big enough to give you everything you want... is big enough to take it all away... still stands

BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR!!!

I agree with your statement about big government and I think history would show it to be true.

bd111 · January 30th, 2012, 04:42 PM

Isn't this in the same sewage stream as the ammo ban Chicago passed in the last couple years? IIRC, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 7th Circuit declared the ammo ban unconstitutional because a lawful gun possessor has to have ammo to exercise his/her Heller rights. The bill is DOA if it reaches Gov. Christie's desk.

Mattitude · January 30th, 2012, 07:42 PM

Good God if this POS gets passed then the ammunition manufacturers should take the same stand that Ronnie Barrett did with California and not just pull chalks but flat out refuse to sell their products to the state agencies. Blaming "illegal guns" for police injuries/fatalities is such a scharade. More people are killed from drunk driving but prohibition didn't work and car sales aren't restricted.

rscalzo · January 30th, 2012, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Chris Christie (R) would have to sign this.

I figure he wouldn't.

Are you kidding? He made his career on gun cases.

The actual statute has been in effect since the mid 90's. Added to it is a new phrase of six or eight sentences.

This is one area that is so vague that problems could easily arise in the future.

(

Quote:

b) after testing, the Attorney General determines poses a threat to the safety and well being of law enforcement officers because of the materials, be they metallic or nonmetallic, used in its composition or because its ogive, core or jacket are of a design, construction or formulation which makes it capable of breaching or penetrating body armor

tmcfalls · January 31st, 2012, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 54321

Courts of late dont take The Constitution into account so much. The sooner this gets squashed in the New Jersey Legislature the better.

By no means am I advocating no action at the state and local level. I am just glad that idiots are introducing such bills in the current political climate. In no time in my life have I seen such a pro-gun movement and climate. I believe introducing such bills now will set the anti-gun movement back years because they will be handily defeated at some level. I applaud the unintentional effort to destroy their movement.

rscalzo · January 31st, 2012, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Because of New Jersey’s longstanding poorly crafted definition of “defaced” firearms, it is possible that refinishing a firearm, or long-term damage from rust or scratches from ordinary wear and tear, could be deemed “defacement” subjecting honest gun owners to lengthy prison sentences, even though identifying information on the firearm is still legible.

The only problem is regardless of if this bill goes through or not, that will still exist in the same form as it has since 1997. the change in that phrase only applies if the firearm meeting that definition is used in a crime or is stolen.

As far as state law involving state law and defaced firearms, there is case law that expands on that area under State v Smith.

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/nj-suprem...t/1311754.html

One comment that I find a bit misleading..

Quote:

definition of “defaced” firearms, it is possible that refinishing a firearm

Unless the work was done by a totally incompetent vendor using Krylon spray paint, any professional would not do a refinishing job that ended with that result. I've had more than a few refinished and the lettering was as clear as beforehand.

tmcfalls · January 31st, 2012, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rscalzo

The only problem is regardless of if this bill goes through or not, that will still exist in the same form as it has since 1997. the change in that phrase only applies if the firearm meeting that definition is used in a crime or is stolen.

As far as state law involving state law and defaced firearms, there is case law that expands on that area under State v Smith.

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/nj-suprem...t/1311754.html

One comment that I find a bit misleading..

Unless the work was done by a totally incompetent vendor using Krylon spray paint, any professional would not do a refinishing job that ended with that result. I've had more than a few refinished and the lettering was as clear as beforehand.

If any of the gun orgs was worth their salt they would helping to take some of these cases to court and get these laws overturned.

TheTurtle · January 31st, 2012, 12:19 PM

We had a similar one flow through the bowels of our POS state not too long ago. It stayed around the system longer than it needed to. Was supposed to limit how much handgun ammunition we could buy per month, we would also be thumb printed and i believe they wanted a background check as well.

Long story short, they ruled it unconstitutional and it was thrown out.

In the time leading up to the deadline, ammunition was going out of stock EVERYWHERE. Wallyworld couldn't keep any in stock. (the .40's were my fault, sorry guys). People were stocking up as if a revolution was on the horizon. Just like how AR's flew off the shelves when the Obama infestation hit the white house.

I see lots of ammunition sales in New Jersey's near future.

rscalzo · January 31st, 2012, 12:38 PM

Sometimes I think the manufacturers themselves get someone to introduce some off the wall legislation just to drive up sales.

54321 · January 31st, 2012, 12:40 PM

Isn't Ammoman.com out of NJ. Wonder if he's looking to relocate.

Coffindancer · January 31st, 2012, 01:17 PM

Quote:

And I want to make sure that we don't have an abundance of guns out there.

Abundance - A very large quantity of something.

WTF?

Well Mr. Christie, that's one big step to making sure we don't have an abundance of liberty either.

We certainly don't have to worry about having an abundance of patriots in politics. Or an abundance of morals, brains, or anything else worth having.

Perhaps voters should ensure that you don't have an abundance of time in office.

rscalzo · January 31st, 2012, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Isn't Ammoman.com out of NJ. Wonder if he's looking to relocate

He doesn't ship to NJ although you can pick up at the shop.

GARRARD · January 31st, 2012, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Monday, January 30th, 2012 at 6:55 PM

By Scott Bach

Trenton, NJ --(Ammoland.com)- After a massive outcry from the Second Amendment community against A588 (backdoor ammo ban) and A1013 (defacing firearms – unintended consequences), the Assembly Law and Public Safety Committee “held” A588 and amended A1013 in response to gun owner concerns.

The effect of holding A588 is to send it back to the drawing board for further review and amendment, and this legislation that would have opened the door to a sweeping ammunition ban will not advance in its present form.

The amendments to A1013 are still under review, but it is very apparent from the actions of the Committee and the on-the-record statements made by its members that the Committee has heard honest gun owners loud and clear.

We will continue to monitor these bills and dozens of others that we are watching and provide early warning of threats to our Second Amendment rights.

And thank you for your calls, faxes and emails to the Committee members!

About Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs:
The Association of New Jersey Rifle and Pistol Clubs, Inc. is the official NRA State Association in New Jersey. Our mission is to implement all of the programs and activities at the state level that the NRA does at the national level. This mission includes the following: To support and defend the constitutional rights of the people to keep and bear arms. To take immediate action against any legislation at the local, state and federal level that would infringe upon these rights. Visit: www.anjrpc.org

http://www.ammoland.com/2012/01/30/n...back-ammo-ban/

CAVman · January 31st, 2012, 03:52 PM

As I stated above...the Next Thing... New Jersey Gun Owners must do is make sure that all sponsors and supporters of the bills get clearly identified and defeated in the next election!
THAT sends the most powerful message! Cause And Effect !

CAVman in WYoming

charlesPOSTLEwade · January 31st, 2012, 04:20 PM

Just My Opinion Here But it Seems to me if they Banned ammunition It Would be the same as Banning Arms. Hence a Lawsuit all the way to the SCOTUS .would a bunch of idiots
WE have them to in Illinois. They are introducing a Bill to ban Semi Auto Pistols and Rifles. If you already Own then they would be Grandfathered in . But you would have to register within a set amount of time or go to jail
Aint Happen here. S Hitcago at its best