M14 Forum


M14 Full Auto Parts

This is a discussion on M14 Full Auto Parts within the Full Automatics forums, part of the Gun Forum category; Is it legal to own these without a class III license? http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=290189522 later, dozer...


Go Back   M14 Forum > Gun Forum > Full Automatics

3Thanks
Reply
 
LinkBack Moderator Tools Display Modes

Old June 6th, 2012, 07:56 PM   #1
Old Salt
 
dozerhand's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: S.W. Calirado
Posts: 1,009
M14 Full Auto Parts

Is it legal to own these without a class III license?

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=290189522

later, dozer

dozerhand is offline  
Remove Ads
Old June 6th, 2012, 08:24 PM   #2
Banned Camp
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,779
From my understanding, yes you can own the parts as long as they are not in a reciever without a classIII.

slayer6769 is offline  
Old June 6th, 2012, 08:26 PM   #3
Scout Sniper
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: louisiana
Posts: 768
If my understanding of the law is correct if you have a lic. class 3 m14 its ok or if you are a class 3 or class 5 dealer/manuf. its ok. otherwise its illegal to possess the parts to make a firearm full auto.

I remember that someone at a gun show had a auto sear for a M16 and that was the one of the defining parts. the M16 bolt carrer was not a defining part.
thats what the dealer told me. the sear had to be sold to a class 3 dealer or someone who possessed a legal m16. I assume the M14 would be the same.

I have a friend who is a class 3 dealer. I'll ask him next time I see him. I don't want no part of full auto...I am just too cheap to waste ammo spraying it down range.


Last edited by gatorshooter; June 6th, 2012 at 08:42 PM.
gatorshooter is offline  
Old June 6th, 2012, 08:44 PM   #4
Old Salt
 
BLACKTAIL 8541's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,740
It is leagle to own or purchase full auto m14 parts as long as they do not attach to the receiver. They are commonly used to make dummy kits that are attached to the stock.

BLACKTAIL 8541 is offline  
Old June 6th, 2012, 09:56 PM   #5
Platoon Sergeant
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: ca
Posts: 305
lol. i logged on right now and see the same ad and had the same question...

bigkicks is offline  
Old June 6th, 2012, 10:13 PM   #6
Banned Camp
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,779
Ive seen select fire kits for AKs for sale on various sites and no license required for purchase but class III rules apply. Meaning they can't be in a reciever unless uou have a class III and you can not install them in a weapon that's not already a class III.
I believe Brownells also has some select fire parts as well.

slayer6769 is offline  
Old June 6th, 2012, 10:25 PM   #7
Site Sponsor
 
ShootingSight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 1,659
I am not a lawyer, and this is free internet advice, so value it accordingly:

You may not have a full auto firearm, or something that can be readily converted into a full auto firearm.

The legality question hinges around who it is who may define what 'readily converted into' means. If you have ar AR receiver with the extra pivot holes in it, and you have full-auto parts on the table next to the rifle, that is clearly ready to go - you just have to drop the parts in. Even if they are not physically in the rifle, this is still readily converted, and you fail. If the extra pivot holes are not in the receiver, that is questionable because you'd have to do some machining on the receiver to get the parts to fit, though with a drill guide and a drill press, you could have them in there in a few minutes. If you have a rear receiver where the back of the trigger well is too narrow for them to fit, that is a little further from readily convertible. I think I recall reading that years ago the standard was that you could achieve the mods in under a few hours on a mill, however with the advent of CNC mills, you can make an entire receiver in less time than that, so I do not know what the current interpretation of this standard is.

So, you play the game - if you do not have all the parts, I think you cannot readily convert. So a dummy kit with only the button, but no other parts is pretty safe. If you are missing the full auto tab that hangs down from the receiver, you might argue that you cannot readily re-attach it.

My personal test is that I do not want the parts and the receiver to be in the same building.

To answer your question, they are not defacto illegal to own, but can become illegal in the wrong circumstances.

Thanks from bigkicks and Ric2504

Last edited by ShootingSight; June 7th, 2012 at 06:23 AM.
ShootingSight is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 07:39 AM   #8
Old Salt
 
Mainzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,884
I believe they are legal. It is the receiver that is controlled. Otherwise, how else could STEN kits (for example) be sold legally? These kits have ALL the parts except the receiver.

In addition, I believe the receivers of semi or full auto M14/M1As are different from one another. When people make replicas of full autos (which are semi auto only) they have to prove to BATFE that they "can't be made full auto!

I'm interested to see how this is finally (and correctly) answered.

Mainzer is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 10:00 AM   #9
Old Salt
 
BLACKTAIL 8541's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Brown View Post
With the exception of the AR15 and a couple of M2 Carbine parts there is no problem.
The regulations only apply to parts that can be used to convert semiauto rifles to full auto. M14 selector parts cannot be used to convert a semi auto M1A or other commercial M14 type rifle to full auto since there is no provision for attachment of the parts to the receiver as on a GI M14. If you have a M1 Carbine some select fire parts are OK, but not the disconnector or M2 hammer. In the case of the AR15, no M16 parts are allowed in the rifle. That includes the bolt carrier, disconnector, etc. Even if not installed, possesion of these parts while possessing the rifle may be a felony.

The ATF told me that having a selector switch installed in a M1 Carbine is OK as long as the rifle does not fire full auto. The switch can be installed without the disconnector. In the case of the M14/M1A the parts must be modified to fit and installed in the stock. They do not convert the rifle to full auto and therefore are legal.

The regulations are confusing, arbitrary, and somewhat dependent on the whims of the enforcer. Causion is advised, but the dummy selector is legal in your rifle.

A little info from a quick search.

BLACKTAIL 8541 is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 12:38 PM   #10
Banned Camp
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,779
You can't install select fire parts in a M1A, it is different than a M14.
My question is, even if it is perfectly legal and I think it is, why buy select fire parts if you can't use them?? Seems the money would be better spent on something you can use like ammo or even another M1A. Just my opinion.

slayer6769 is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 01:05 PM   #11
Site Sponsor
 
ShootingSight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 1,659
You are allowed to put an M16 bolt carrier in an AR. At least as far as I know.

ShootingSight is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 01:30 PM   #12
Old Salt
 
IRON WORKER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 1,460
Very grey area

I've had a couple of these but the sear contacts were removed imediatly.

Paragraph from BATF web page:

Included within the definition of machinegun is any part designed and intended solely and exclusively,
or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun. This
portion of the machinegun definition addresses what are commonly referred to as conversion kits. The
“any part designed and intended solely and exclusively” language refers to a part that was produced for
no other reason than to convert a weapon into a machinegun. Illustrated below are examples of such
parts


http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...-chapter-2.pdf

IRON WORKER is offline  
Old June 7th, 2012, 02:49 PM   #13
Old Salt
 
dozerhand's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: S.W. Calirado
Posts: 1,009
I was just wondering about the legalities. I thought it would make for an interesting conversation. I did a quick search on GB for M14 M1A, looking for things to make the new rifle uniquely mine and that popped up in the search. Mostly looking for a used syn stock to do a redneck modstock build. Eventually I want to go Rogue but don't have the scratch right now.
later, dozer

p.s. I have searched for the thread on building a redneck modstock but it evades me can anyone point me in the right direction

dozerhand is offline  
Old June 9th, 2012, 09:46 AM   #14
Lifer
 
M14E2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,988
The regulated part is the receiver. The so-called 'full-auto' parts are just pieces of metal. The don't fit on a commercial receiver. They cannot make a full-auto from a semi without extensive and comlpicated (and illegal) machining and welding.

M14E2 is offline  
Old June 9th, 2012, 08:21 PM   #15
Retired
 
Old Sarge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,125
Quote:
Originally Posted by art7 View Post
You are allowed to put an M16 bolt carrier in an AR. At least as far as I know.
I believer that is not legal. I have somewhere in my archives a page from "The American Rifleman" about the full auto select fire parts for the M16 that are different than our semi-auto parts. Bolt carrier, hammer, sear, selector, etc. Any one of these M16 parts in your rifle, even though it will not go full auto, is verbotten. Unless that ruling has changed since this article was published.

As for M14 full auto parts, if they were controlled parts, you wouldn't be able to buy them or possess them without a class III license. They attach to the M14 receiver, and civilian receivers are made to prevent attachment of said parts.

Old Sarge is offline  
Reply

  M14 Forum > Gun Forum > Full Automatics



Search tags for this page
am i allowed to own m14
,
convert commercial m1a to full auto
,
full auto
,

full auto m14

,
full auto m1a1 springfield
,
how to convert a m1 carbine to full auto
,
how to make m1a full auto
,
m14 full auto
,

m14 full auto parts

,
m14 machinegun selector parts
,
m1a full auto
,
m1a full auto conversion
Click on a term to search for related topics.

Moderator Tools
Display Modes


Similar M14 Forum Discussions
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bad mouthing m14 THREE RINGS The M14 83 September 2nd, 2014 04:12 PM
Full Auto M14 Noface The M14 22 February 3rd, 2012 04:23 PM
Basic Tools for the M14 builder brycom1 Gunsmithing 22 June 24th, 2011 12:59 PM
? USGI M14s NFA'34 jim-analog The M14 7 March 3rd, 2010 02:50 PM



Top Gun Sites Top Sites List