This is a discussion on Results with 155-gr Loads/Reloads? within the Ammunition forums, part of the M14 M1A Forum category; What are your results?
I've posted this elsewhere and and not getting any reports of what accuracy levels people are getting out of their M14 ...
I've posted this elsewhere and and not getting any reports of what accuracy levels people are getting out of their M14 types.
Hornady Match ammo with A-Maxes shoots MOA or better, but I can't get reloads with SMKs (older 2155), Noslers, A-Maxes, or even Bergers (found a hot deal on their first version) to group tight.
Best is about 1.1 inches at 100 yards, rare and not very repeatable. Most are 1.4-1.8 inches. Some are 2.0-2.3. Hot-rodded one load with A-Maxes and 3 shots went into 3.5 inches.
The barrel time shown by QuickLOAD for the powders I've used are in the vicinity what another source says is halfway between "optimum barrel time" nodes for a 22-inch barrel. Maybe there's something to that after all, but my 175 and 178-grain loads are shooting .6 to .9 inches at 100 yards quite reliably, and they're not on the supposed OBT node either.
For me, it's so much for the theory that lighter bullets do better in a 1:12 twist. They don't, but the 175s do.
Can any of you get the 155s to group, and if so, how?
It's not bullet weight that should determine twist rate, it's bullet length!
The old Greenhill Formula that specified a certain rate of twist for bullets of a certain weight has been obsolete for years. It was originally based on round nosed bullets, so one could figure that the heavier the bullet was the longer it would be.
That old standard is no longer valid. The correct rule of thumb is the longer the bullet - the faster the twist. It is quite common for a lighter bullet of a certain diameter to be longer than a heavier bullet of the same diameter due to bullet design. Many of the modern 155's in .308 diameter are longer than some of the 175's like the SMK. This is even more true with the new solid alloy bullets which tend to weigh less for a given length.
I haven't finished playing with the 155's in my LRB yet, but I can tell you a few of the things that I found out -
I cant get the VLD's to group well when seated at magazine length (2.800" +/-) but they're really not suppposed to.
I've had better results with the Sierra Palma's than the SMK's.
The Lapua Scenar 155's look promising.
Launching the 155's fast enough to take full advantage of them out of an M14 is pushing (or exceeding) the design limits of the rifle. Excessive pressure combined with a pressure curve that is beyond the design parameters of the M14 can only cause bad things sooner or later.
Grump, I firmly believe in OBT and Quickload. But I say that OBT's do not apply to M14's and Garands due to all the crap out front throwing off the harmonics and therefore calculations. OBT is wonderful for bolt guns, but ...
I have been shooting a boatload of nos 155's the last couple of years. Shoot well in most -14's. 44 gr Varget is a standard, and 45 gr is nice too.
Nothing wrong with 1.5 MOA groups - anything better is a fluke, AFAIK.
Group sizes and velocities? I'm intrigued.
Nice reading on your group size/targeting capabilities. What's the speed?
To all: Running QuickLOAD, with the powder speed adjusted to match my velocities with at least four powders, I'm seeing port pressure be the limit before chamber pressure. This is especially after I realized that the bullet is clearing the gas port at 12.5 inches of travel, rather than the 14.1 I was looking at before (port's 14.125 from the boltface--QL goes my bullet distance traveled). Was all ready to hot-rod with Reloder 15 until I checked that. For 155s, the conclusion is that some powders will max port pressure at about 2850 fps, most at about 2810 some right at 2750. In every instance, chamber pressure was predicted to be definitely NOT max.
In my experience some barrels just don't like 155's. IMHO this may have more to due with the 155's relatively smaller baring surface ( the part of the bullet that actually contacts the rifleing) than most other bullets. With the wider variety of 155's available today theres a better chance of a rifle liking certain brands of 155's than others.
Group sizes and velocities? I'm intrigued.
OAL : 2.800"
Group sizes are slightly under a inch for me at 100 yards.
I quite measuring velocities a while back and I just measuring my groupings.
I generally go hunting a lot, and I found that the 155 Grain A-Max are quite destructive on white tail deer and feral hogs. So it was more important to me to be able to hit where I want, and not speed. (Yeah I know many will say not to use A-Max Bullets, but from my experience they work REALLY WELL on Deer and Hogs).
I thought my rifle didn't like 155's either until I got some Black Hills Gold with 155 AMAX and shot a 5-round cloverleaf at 100 yards.
After that I measured the OAL and tried to replicate that as best I could with my loads.
Using Lake City brass that has been small-base resized, trimmed, flash holes reamed and primer pockets uniformed I was able to get very good results with 155gr AMAX bullets over H4895 and WLR primers...though not as good as the Black Hills Gold. Don't try to run them too hot. 2700 FPS is about my average for this load. If I push them closer to 2800 I get pressure signs and erratic accuracy. Also, I jump them a little, OAL 2.790"
I have been trying loads with Nosler Custom comps 155 and RL-15. So far I am happy with 42 grs. Though I have not chronoed the load yet. My groups were in the 1.5-2.0 range, but I have found that I have a coonector lock issue that is causing me some problems. I went up to 43 grs but saw no improvement so I decided I would stay at 42.0 grs. No pressure signs or hard cycling noticed.
I just got a five shot 1.5" 100 yard group yesterday with Hornady 150 gr FMJs over 41.5 of IMR4895, 2.800 COL, with irons, through a 18" Bush Rifle.
These are those farked up bullets with a canelure that is no where near being right for .308 OR 30.06.
The Amax 155s did not perform much better. I had one five shot group that came in at 1.25" with 43.5gr of that RG4895 crap. Same standard Bush Rifle.
Been working with the RG4895 to find a good load just because I bought 16lbs of that crap from Wideners and don't want to waste that money. I am finding that there is only about a 2 to 3 grain window where this stuff works on 7.62x51 and can't get an acceptable load at all for the Garand. MUCH slower than IMR4895. The RG4895 jug came with ONE load on the label . . . 147gr FMJ over 44gr RG4895 in 7.62x51. 45gr is a compressed charge and shows flattened and cratered primers, 43 grains starts to show signs of underpressure . . sooty neck, 42gr the whole case is sooty. . . . . And this stuff throws fireballs that trip those satelites that look for nuclear detonations . .
The fubar 150gr FMJs are one half the cost of the Amax . . . Guess which bullet I'm gonna use.