175 GMM = +/- XM118 LR - M14 Forum

M14 Forum


175 GMM = +/- XM118 LR

This is a discussion on 175 GMM = +/- XM118 LR within the Ammunition forums, part of the M14 M1A Forum category; Just for my own information, I pulled 10 rnds each of 175 GMM and XM118 LR from 2011 randomly from the stash. For what it ...


Go Back   M14 Forum > M14 M1A Forum > Ammunition

24Thanks
Reply
 
LinkBack Moderator Tools Display Modes

Old March 5th, 2017, 05:34 AM   #1
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
nf1e's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New Preston,CT
Posts: 7,133
175 GMM = +/- XM118 LR

Just for my own information, I pulled 10 rnds each of 175 GMM and XM118 LR from 2011 randomly from the stash.

For what it is worth, after pulling bullets from casings and weighing components this is what I found.

Both appear to use Reloader 15 as powder.

GMM adverage power charge 43.5
XM118 " " " 43.2

Bullet weights were the same.

XM118 bullets sealed at cartridge neck.

XM case weight is approx 3 gn heavier 404.1 than GMM 401.3

Primers both appear to be 210M.

This was done because at 200 yds. the impact has been identical.
Chrono at 12' is the same for both.

Conclusion 6 of one half a dozen of the other.


Semper Fi
Art

Thanks from Bamban, 2336USMC, tonyben and 9 others
nf1e is offline  
Remove Ads
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:44 AM   #2
Old Salt
 
CHARLIED308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,543
I don't know what the differences are between 175g GMM and M118LR, but I see a difference in accuracy when fired through my bolt action rifle. I have a heavy barrel Savage 10FCP with HS stock. On it is mounted a Nightforce NXS 5.5x22-50mm scope.

At distances out to 300 yards the M118LR consistently shoots right at 1 MOA. It is not uncommon for 175g GMM to shoot 1/2 MOA at 300 yards on a no wind day.

Do you see wider variations in charge weight with the M118LR? Could the M118LR brass be the reason I am seeing accuracy differences?

I have used Reloder 15 for 1,000 yard loads with good results.

CHARLIED308 is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:44 AM   #3
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: NJ
Posts: 5,054

Awards Showcase

FGMM is currently 4064.

It was used as the basis for the Mk 316 Mod 0 cartridge, which is available as GM762M2.

Otherwise they are identical (except all the M118LR I have seen has been pretty dirty).

My scale shows just over 43 grains in each cartridge.

Older FGMM might be RL15, not sure.

KurtC is offline  
 
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:49 AM   #4
Old Salt
 
CHARLIED308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,543
Thanks for the info KurtC. A few people I shoot with use IMR 4064. It would be worth my time to work up a load with it and try it out.

CHARLIED308 is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:52 AM   #5
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
nf1e's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New Preston,CT
Posts: 7,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by CHARLIED308 View Post
I don't know what the differences are between 175g GMM and M118LR, but I see a difference in accuracy when fired through my bolt action rifle. I have a heavy barrel Savage 10FCP with HS stock. On it is mounted a Nightforce NXS 5.5x22-50mm scope.

At distances out to 300 yards the M118LR consistently shoots right at 1 MOA. It is not uncommon for 175g GMM to shoot 1/2 MOA at 300 yards on a no wind day.

Do you see wider variations in charge weight with the M118LR? Could the M118LR brass be the reason I am seeing accuracy differences?

I have used Reloder 15 for 1,000 yard loads with good results.
Variation in loads was .3 for each.

nf1e is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:54 AM   #6
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
nf1e's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New Preston,CT
Posts: 7,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by KurtC View Post
FGMM is currently 4064.

It was used as the basis for the Mk 316 Mod 0 cartridge, which is available as GM762M2.

Otherwise they are identical (except all the M118LR I have seen has been pretty dirty).

My scale shows just over 43 grains in each cartridge.

Older FGMM might be RL15, not sure.
Exactly why I specified 2011 production.

I have been using 4064 myself and it works for me.

Just a cold Sunday morning observation to share with the gang.

nf1e is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 05:57 AM   #7
Old Salt
 
CHARLIED308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,543
Is there a source that shows which powder was used in which years for Federal GMM or M118LR?

CHARLIED308 is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 06:02 AM   #8
Master Gunner
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Oscar Mike
Posts: 876
M118lr was re15

spsosicmcise is online now  
Old March 5th, 2017, 06:03 AM   #9
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
nf1e's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New Preston,CT
Posts: 7,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by CHARLIED308 View Post
Is there a source that shows which powder was used in which years for Federal GMM or M118LR?
I am sure there is somewhere.
I broke these down because they both shot the same. I have other GMM that shoots completely different.
It is pretty rare for me to change ammo in my 700 and not have to change dope.

Thanks from rwilli
nf1e is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 06:12 AM   #10
Old Salt
 
CHARLIED308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,543
I just pulled a box from the last lot of Long Range M118 I purchased last year. The brass is marked LC 01 LR, so that may account for the difference in accuracy.

I haven't chronographed this lot of M118 LR, but it seems to be loaded a little hotter than GMM. Groups are concentric, just not as small as GMM groups.

CHARLIED308 is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 07:15 AM   #11
Lifer
 
BLACKTAIL 8541's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 2,266
I have been putting off loading some LR ammo. To busy or lazy to do the load work up this last year. I have a good supply for now of the 175 Sierra match kings and IMR 4064. Enough to load 7k plus rounds.This thread reminded me to get at it.

BLACKTAIL 8541 is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 08:02 AM   #12
Dodgin' The Reaper
 
nf1e's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New Preston,CT
Posts: 7,133
What better way to spend a Sunday morning.
Just for the heck of it I loaded up 50 DAG berdan casings with the 43.2 Re 15 load. Some of my best shooting has been using DAG casings. The TULA primers seem to be right on the money as far as consistency.

If I can ever beat this 10 rnd group I did a few years ago, I will be one happy camper.



Semper Fi
Art

nf1e is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 10:47 AM   #13
Rifleman
 
Hot Brass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Phoenix,Az
Posts: 65
If this is worth anything to help. I read that Uncle Sam is going back to IMR4064 for M118LR.
I have started to develope a load through my SSG-69, and a M1A NM. I have not finished, there is still a question about COAL to be answered.
My 168SMK load finally liked 2.822"-2.838" .
I'm also going to use LC brass, back the charge down to 41.6gr.-41.8gr. For testing to find the sweet spot again.
Someone determined Uncle Sugar is using 41.745gr. of IMR4064.
Just a couple of weeks testing, nothing final.
Hope it helps someway,
Hot Brass, out
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_1746.JPG (944.7 KB, 28 views)

Thanks from rolex87
Hot Brass is offline  
Old March 5th, 2017, 12:25 PM   #14
Old Salt
 
lysander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,753
You have to remember, each lot of propellant has its own personality. For low volume products, like M118, they can cherry pick the exact propellant types and lots that gives the best accuracy as well as other factors, like pressure, etc.

One lot of propellant would probably make an entire run of M118. With a high volume product, billions of rounds, like M80, you really are stuck with a single propellant type.

Just because for a few years LCAAP loaded up a batch of M118 with Reloader 15, does not necessarily mean all Reloader is more accurate than IMR 4046, just that they had a particularly good lot, or two, of Re15.

Thanks from nf1e

Last edited by lysander; March 5th, 2017 at 12:36 PM.
lysander is online now  
Old March 5th, 2017, 01:13 PM   #15
Newbie
 
Mjordan1261's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 9
M118 is some awesome Ammo, same Ammo used by our Military snipers, I have some M118 I'm no longer shooting, Moved on to handloads. I consider selling if anyone is interested. Just PM me.

Mjordan1261 is offline  
Reply

  M14 Forum > M14 M1A Forum > Ammunition

Moderator Tools
Display Modes


Similar M14 Forum Discussions
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Federal 175 GMM $20 a box with free shipping cubrock Bargains 2 June 29th, 2016 06:50 AM
Federal GMM 175 grain at SGAmmo bustabuddy Bargains 0 January 20th, 2014 06:04 PM
175 g xm118 Shirley Ammunition 5 August 28th, 2012 08:12 AM
147gr for break in of 175 gr sniper rifle. BangkokPaul Ammunition 34 May 21st, 2011 08:34 PM
175 GR Sniper bullet reloading info pjogrinc Ammunition 3 December 5th, 2008 09:42 AM



Top Gun Sites Top Sites List