I picked the worst time to buy my first handgun, last December, a 1911 style 45. Despite the madness I was able to find everything I needed to load my own (after 6 months of searching). I was only able to find some jacketed 230 grain hardball bullets then. I recently got some hard cast 230 gr round nose bullets which I'd like to switch to for range time due to cost. I haven't gotten around to shooting any of them yet. My only problem is for some reason I feel like I should keep some hardball bullets around. Is there any reason to keep some hardball around if the cast bullets work well??
I use hardball as the last round fired from the magazine. This helps keep the leading down when target shooting. I also have a few mags loaded with hardball should I need them for things other than target practice.
I have a well pampered military box of WCC 66 hardball that I keep in a special place of honor. I KNOW that stuff will shoot each & every time.
BTW...on that subject...My MeetUp group is coming over today to watch one of the original survivlists movies...Panic In The Year Zero, made in 1962 with Ray Miland and Frankie Avalon.
in one part of the movie, Ray finds a doctor at his house and the Dr patches up someone. He is talking with him and says, I have no money to pay you.
The Dr looks at him & says money is no good anymore anyway, but I see you also carry a .45. Got any extra ammo. Ray gives him three (3) rounds of good old military, shoots all the time, BALL. Something to think about.
Hard cast lead bullets can have more penetration than ball ammo. Inside the relatively thin copper jacket of FMJ is soft, swaged lead.
Honestly, I think it is a moot issue with the velocities of a .45 ACP, but with magnums, you'll find hard cast lead bullets in most revolvers used for defense in bear country.
I carry a .45 daily, loaded with hardball. Hollow points are not critically important for defense in big-bore, moderate-velocity bullets.
EDIT: I just realized you were probably comparing hardball to JHP, not to hard cast. I confused myself with another post.
IMO, it's good to keep a box or three of hardball around.
That's what the pistol was designed to work with, it works just fine.
Hardball makes a good baseline to try if other bullets don't feed reliably.
I shoot hard ball exclusively I am of the belief the key here is penetration. I believe you will get deeper with ball than HP. Since I have never been there and done that it's just a belief
I bought a 1K case of Fiocchi .45 ACP in hardball a couple years ago just ahead of the drought thankfully. QUESTION: this Fiocchi is BRASS JACKETED. Anyone have any or heard any negs on BRASS JACKETED ammo??? In my .45's (Norinco/ATS Titan) no indigestion issues after 200 RDS...
PS:
I like hardball just fine and will always have some in my cans as (like was said here) my 1911's & ball were designed for each other.
I'll back that up with this:
I traded an iPhone 3GS for a 50 rd. box of .45 hardball!! Yea, I like it alot...
DI5
Back in the early 80s before we could get decent hollowpoint ammo for our 1911s. I used to carry Geco 230 hardball as police duty ammo since it had a reputation for being a bit hotter. I liked the fact that it had a sealed primer and was very reliable in all of my pistols. I once used one round of it to dispatch a huge Bull that had gotten loose for several days and the owner requested that I put it down. It worked like a charm and the Bull dropped like it had been hit by Thor's hammer. One round to the left ear put it down immediately.
Back then about the only decent hollowpoint ammo around was either Winchester 185 grain Silver Tips or the old Super Vel when you could find it. I knew that I needed deep penetration to put the Bull down so I dropped my mag of Super Vel and reloaded my Colt Series 70 1911 with Geco hardball. Once the Bull was dead we called a wrecker who loaded it on a trailer and it was taken to the county boy's home where it was processed and fed to the kids.
The cops in the county back then who favored 1911s or Sig P-220's used to say that we played ball with hardball. For one thing pistols that would reliably feed the hollowpoints of the day (especially the excellent Speer Lawman 200 grain HP flying ashtrays), weren't all that common and reliability came before all else.
I have Federal HST and the older Hydra Shok 45 ACP for home defence. I use Hard Ball for target shooting and save the brass to reload with cast bullets. Also keep and store Hardball for SHTF scenario if needed. All of it is 230 grain....
If you are talking re-loading jacketed 45 bullets vs lead, I have quit using lead in all my reloads. Too much scrubbing to get the barrel clean. More barrels are ruined by overcleaning than by being shot out.
I reload for my handguns with copper plated bullets from Rocky Mountain Reloading. About the same price as lead without the leading issue.
If a barrel is leaded, the bullet fit is wrong, and the alloy is too hard or soft for the load used. If the fit is correct and the bullet hardness matches the pressure curve, it's no worse than jacket. Yes, there is a learning curve and some effort compared to plated cast, but it can be done.
I first learned this in a lightly loaded 44. Badly leaded and nice "patterns". Hey. I know I can shoot better than that. With a warmer load, clean barrel and "groups"
I guess it's possible to ruin one by improper cleaning, but I've not heard of that, either. A typical .45 is not a match pistol, so how would you know it was "shot out" anyway?
I'm not trying to be a smart ass. I honestly didn't know this was an issue, and maybe it is!
Is there confusion overall from a .45 ammo question being in the M14 ammunition forum?
I personally have seen shot out .45 barrels, but have never shot out one. I have a .45 that I purchased new and it have 12-15K through it (with bushing). No issues. I have another in 4.25 and it is about a year old with 2.8K through it.
.45 is not high pressure (but it can be), and it's not exactly fast either.
Geco is very good ammo, have not seen it in the past few years though.
I shoot quite a bit of lead and ball in my .45s…just keep the barrel clean and I keep all these pistols very 'wet'.
Load 5 rounds of HP then top mag off with hardball, no worries with hardball jamming, by time you get to the HP in the Mag threat should be neutralized or running away with a load in their pants. Use the HP to avoid a lawsuit, if needed.
I shoot Hollow point and FMJ have not had any problems. These are my reloads btw.
I was buying 308 223 and 45 Hornady Full metal jacket projectiles for dirt cheap prices prior to sandy hook. I have no problem using Full metal jacket ammo. I doubt the bad guy will notice the difference when being shot by 45 with Full metal jacket or hollow point ammo. Its not like he is going to say hey that didn't hurt me because its Full metal jacket...USN3
Buy what works,both.
Well, I bought another case of hardball bullets just to have on hand. When I find some JHP bullets back in stock I would like to try some of those as well. I load my own so I don't think I'll have a problem with them. I do like to have options. Besides, if I decide I don't want the hardball, I won't have any problems selling them.
I have a shot out 1911 barrel...it was made in 1913 and it puts bullets through the target sideways. I certainly didn't shoot it out. It was worn out before I was even born.
Hate to tell you but putting a jacketed round down the pipe after lead doesn't cut down on lead in the barrel, it just irons it into the barrel grooves. I haven't seen any bullets with little scrub pads on them yet but it would be a good idea for the ammo companies
I am the wrong person to ask, I keep hundreds of rounds stored "for a rainy day" because when it finally rains it's probably going to pour!!
For my .45's it's primarily 230 Gr. FMJ hardball. Lets face it it's the most reliable feeding, and somebody hit by it probably isn't going to stand there saying "Pfft, spitballs!!"
It's always a good idea to keep 230gr hardball on hand. I have plenty of Ranger-T on hand for emergencies, as well as plenty of factory new hardball. That ammo I never touch, it is for emergency or SHTF, that is in addition to ammo for practice.
m14brian
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